VG23 New Build

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mhd
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Re: VG23 New Build

Post by mhd »

Tested a simple Peltier cooler plate circuit. Used a single TEC1-12715 plate rated at 142 Watts. That thing gets HOT ver quickly - and cold on the other side of course.

I rigged up four 40x40mm fans on top of four 40x40 aluminium heat-sinks and stuck the plate agains a sheet of aluminium. Then used dual temperature probes to test temperature on each side - one is just wedged under the metal plate. Concept works fine, but although the cold side of the plate initially starts to cool, it then starts to warm up - too much thermal conduction between hot/cold sides so I definitely need to build a well-insulated enclosure and use proper thermal paste or some other thermal pad with high heat conduction to do a better test. Circuit draws around 7 or 8 Amps.

Image

Not really sure it is worth the effort, but hopeful at least some kind of useable cool-box might result. And it is too cold here to do much epoxy work so I've got to spend my time doing something until the spring I suppose...

Mick


FB11 (Designer Evan Gatehouse)
VG23 (Designer Jacques Mertens)

A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, con a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly. Specialization is for insects. Robert A. Heinlein.

mhd
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Re: VG23 New Build

Post by mhd »

Pretty much ready to order ply/glass/resin/paint, etc. Will be the first job in 2023. I'm going with S3 (worked well on FB11). However, while I can usually estimate (or over-estimate) epoxy, tape, and cloth, I'm not sure on quantites for paint/primer. I'm not looking for a boat-show finish. Durability is the main criterion.

Based on estimated coverage in the paint specs I was thinking 7.5 gallons of quikfair, 5 gallons of primer, 5 gallons of topside paint, and a couple of gallons of bottom paint.. This is for the VG23 but am now starting to think it will probably need more paint/primer for multiple coats.

To be honest I wouldn't be surprised if it was somewhere between half and double these quantities. Anyone else used S3 on a large boat? Any advice on estimating coverage beyond estimating the square footage and assuming the proposed coverage in the specs is accurate?

Thanks in advance,

Mick
FB11 (Designer Evan Gatehouse)
VG23 (Designer Jacques Mertens)

A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, con a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly. Specialization is for insects. Robert A. Heinlein.

rick berrey
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Re: VG23 New Build

Post by rick berrey »

I have always used sq ft coverage to estimate paint for a project and added 3% . If you can buy local I would not add the 3% , if you have to get it shipped then add the 3% . You will control how the paint is applied and cut down on waist , the paint company also is factoring in some waist as well . I would make a material spread sheet and try to hold to it with both cost and material use , if you buy extra material you will be prone to both waist and over building the boat , resulting in a heavy boat at greater cost . You should look at the project in terms of square footage and treat it like any other construction project , take material bid,s and buy in bulk , line it out from start to finish and know your next step before you get to it . You have already shown you have ability when tackling this project , you might need some encouragement along the way but I don't see you needing much help .

mhd
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Re: VG23 New Build

Post by mhd »

rick berrey wrote: Sat Dec 17, 2022 7:44 am I have always used sq ft coverage to estimate paint for a project and added 3% . If you can buy local I would not add the 3% , if you have to get it shipped then add the 3% . You will control how the paint is applied and cut down on waist , the paint company also is factoring in some waist as well . I would make a material spread sheet and try to hold to it with both cost and material use , if you buy extra material you will be prone to both waist and over building the boat , resulting in a heavy boat at greater cost . You should look at the project in terms of square footage and treat it like any other construction project , take material bid,s and buy in bulk , line it out from start to finish and know your next step before you get to it . You have already shown you have ability when tackling this project , you might need some encouragement along the way but I don't see you needing much help .
Hi Rick,

Yep, it will be shipped, not collected. I am also thinking about a reserve for when (not if) the boat needs touching up in various places.

Thanks. That's good advice that I needed to hear. I'll follow it.

Cheers,

Mick
FB11 (Designer Evan Gatehouse)
VG23 (Designer Jacques Mertens)

A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, con a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly. Specialization is for insects. Robert A. Heinlein.

mhd
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Re: VG23 New Build

Post by mhd »

rick berrey wrote: Sat Dec 17, 2022 7:44 am I have always used sq ft coverage to estimate paint for a project and added 3% . If you can buy local I would not add the 3% , if you have to get it shipped then add the 3% . You will control how the paint is applied and cut down on waist , the paint company also is factoring in some waist as well . I would make a material spread sheet and try to hold to it with both cost and material use , if you buy extra material you will be prone to both waist and over building the boat , resulting in a heavy boat at greater cost . You should look at the project in terms of square footage and treat it like any other construction project , take material bid,s and buy in bulk , line it out from start to finish and know your next step before you get to it . You have already shown you have ability when tackling this project , you might need some encouragement along the way but I don't see you needing much help .
Well, I did the spreadsheet. Very grateful for your comments - they made me think more and that is probably just what I needed. My back-of-envelope pencil had under-estimated the topside paint by 30% and over-estimated bottom paint by 20%. At least as far as my calculations go before the hull is built. Just what I needed. Made me think more. How many coats do I need? How will the changes I plan affect things? Do I epoxy+pigment or paint inside lockers? I think I was getting lazy and good to make me crank the handle and do the work that is required. Good advice that is much appreciated.

Mick
FB11 (Designer Evan Gatehouse)
VG23 (Designer Jacques Mertens)

A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, con a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly. Specialization is for insects. Robert A. Heinlein.

mhd
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Re: VG23 New Build

Post by mhd »

Did another test on a Peltier coll-box with a dummy fuse board. Fuse board will need only minor changes (order a 12V Max volt meter rather than 240V!) plus some more components. Cool box needs more work to get a better differential temperature between in/out but the design looks viable. Will add an extra cooler plate with fan and heatsink, increase/improve insulation, and likely reduce volume - final volume/size/shape will be decided when the hull is built and I can test various locations for it.

Image

Back to UK unexpectedly again today due to family stuff. More in 2023.

Have a Merry Christmas everyone!

Mick
FB11 (Designer Evan Gatehouse)
VG23 (Designer Jacques Mertens)

A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, con a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly. Specialization is for insects. Robert A. Heinlein.

mhd
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Re: VG23 New Build

Post by mhd »

Got back to the US a few days ago. I'd ordered some custom acetal (delrin) bushings for the rudder and they arrived while I was away. Tried to make my own, but acetal isn't easy to cut clean and accurate without machine tools. I could make one myself, but no chance of getting them all matched as accurately as needed. Reasonable price ordered from Patrick at Genesis Tools here...https://www.ebay.com/itm/192461083932 (gentoolco@aol.com).

Send off a schematic sketch of what you want and they quote a price.

Image

Image

Top two brackets for the rudder will be on transom, and the bottom one on the skeg. stainless 316L rod for the rudder pivot and brackets. Rudder for the VG23 should lift for shallow draft - just enough so that it is just above the height of the keel. Will sort out the final fitting once the hull is complete.

Mick
FB11 (Designer Evan Gatehouse)
VG23 (Designer Jacques Mertens)

A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, con a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly. Specialization is for insects. Robert A. Heinlein.

mhd
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Re: VG23 New Build

Post by mhd »

Spec'd out the plywood + epoxy + paint + glass order with Reid in the office and will confirm tomorrow. Plywood ain't cheap, but building a new boat is certainly cheaper than buying a new boat...if you don't count your own labour costs!

Looking forward to getting started on the hull :-)

Mick
FB11 (Designer Evan Gatehouse)
VG23 (Designer Jacques Mertens)

A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, con a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly. Specialization is for insects. Robert A. Heinlein.

fallguy1000
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Re: VG23 New Build

Post by fallguy1000 »

Make sure to buy enuff ply. Freight is mean.
My boat build is here -------->

viewtopic.php?f=12&t=62495

mhd
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Re: VG23 New Build

Post by mhd »

fallguy1000 wrote: Tue Jan 24, 2023 11:57 pm Make sure to buy enuff ply. Freight is mean.
Thanks! Yep, I got enough to make mistakes with :-) Hopefully there won't be too many...measure twice (or thrice!), cut once.
FB11 (Designer Evan Gatehouse)
VG23 (Designer Jacques Mertens)

A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, con a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly. Specialization is for insects. Robert A. Heinlein.

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