D5 weight in 4mm?

To help other builders, please list the boat you are building in the Thread Subject -- and to conserve space, please limit your posting to one thread per boat.

Please feel free to use the gallery to display multiple images of your progress.
PJPiercey
* Bateau Builder - Expert *
* Bateau Builder - Expert *
Posts: 1446
Joined: Thu Aug 29, 2002 1:00 am
Location: WA

Re: D5 weight in 4mm?

Post by PJPiercey »

The lesser expensive sheets of okume tend to soak up more finish material whether it be epoxy or paint. IMHO if you squeegee on two thin coats of epoxy, with minimal sanding between coats, then go strait to the S3 primer. One coat of primer as a guide coat. One thin carefully applied coat of S3 quick fair on the tape seams. Sand the quick fair carefully to try to not go through the first coat of primer (if you do, know worries) along with a VERY light sanding to the rest of the boat. Repeat the primer - quick fair - sanding until you get to the desired finish. Then paint with Serling 8) . You will get the lightest possible boat for level of finish.

When you squeegee on the epoxy you use very little. S3 primer and quick fair are very light for the amount of coverage. Sterling paint is incredibly light for the amount of coverage. You should be able to paint the D5 inside and out with one quart of Sterling. I used two quarts to do the entire FS14.

I think this would give you the lightest, most durable, easy to clean, hull possible.

BTW, I fly fish out of my V12. I actually think, for stand up fly fishing, the vee gives you a more seaworth platform because it gets your feet further below sea level with a lower center of gravity.

Paul
V12, CK17, FL12, FS14

User avatar
gk108
* Bateau Builder - Expert *
* Bateau Builder - Expert *
Posts: 3356
Joined: Thu Jul 28, 2005 6:53 pm
Location: The Peach State

Re: D5 weight in 4mm?

Post by gk108 »

plumbertuck showed us a good example of what happens when you cut corners with the epoxy in this thread.
It only took one season for the problems to show up.
CC, D15, V10

Cascadie
Frequent Poster
Frequent Poster
Posts: 33
Joined: Sun Jul 05, 2009 8:04 pm

Re: D5 weight in 4mm?

Post by Cascadie »

Ok, after getting the plywood, I'm doing a complete 180 on the paint. It's too pretty, I'll shut up about Latex paint and continue coloring. :oops:

Here's the ply, but to be honest, I don't know what it cost, now. Turns out my brother-in-law had built a couple of glue-stitch kayaks and returned a few sheets to the supplier and he hadn't been credited for it, so they just sent it back over. I'm liking the cost of this project so far!

Image

I got all the lines down except the transoms, and got one side cut and sanded. BIL has some nice tools to play with!

Image
Image

Looking to be done cutting, sanding and have everything stitched together tomorrow! As suggested, I'm doing the bottom in 6mm, sides in 4mm.

Kurt

Cascadie
Frequent Poster
Frequent Poster
Posts: 33
Joined: Sun Jul 05, 2009 8:04 pm

Re: D5 weight in 4mm?

Post by Cascadie »

Wow, I just finished the thread on cutting corners. Point taken.

User avatar
AD16 The Opportunist
Active Poster
Active Poster
Posts: 294
Joined: Wed Nov 08, 2006 10:26 am
Location: Germany/Italy

Re: D5 weight in 4mm?

Post by AD16 The Opportunist »

Hi! Only a few words about your plywood choice: Joubert marine ply is, together with Brujnzel marine ply, the best choice you can have in Europe. It's all Lloyd's certified marine ply :wink: 8)

PJPiercey
* Bateau Builder - Expert *
* Bateau Builder - Expert *
Posts: 1446
Joined: Thu Aug 29, 2002 1:00 am
Location: WA

Re: D5 weight in 4mm?

Post by PJPiercey »

Cascadie wrote:Wow, I just finished the thread on cutting corners. Point taken.
Keep in mind that there were enclosed areas on that boat with no epoxy at all. Two coats is all you need to seal the wood. The S3 primer is basically an epoxy resin also. I'm not saying it's a substitute for the two coats but it's good stuff :D .

Keep it light :!: Don't fall into the trap of "over building". It's plenty strong as designed. Every piece works together, so don't judge the strength until it's completely finished.

That wood looks great :D

Paul

Cascadie
Frequent Poster
Frequent Poster
Posts: 33
Joined: Sun Jul 05, 2009 8:04 pm

Re: D5 weight in 4mm?

Post by Cascadie »

I've wet my feet a bit more, and I think I'm going to be very happy with the weight.

I've not made quite the progress that I'd hoped to today, but only due to lack of materials. The day is still young here in the pacific northwest, though. I still have 4-5 hours of daylight. :)

Nearly all the parts. I'm laminating the transoms up to 10mm, so they are not cured just yet. Hopefully by the time I get back to the shop, I'll be able to stitch it up.
Image

I have some Mahogany for the gunwales, but they seem very stiff at 19mm. I'll be doing an inwale also, so I'm thinking of cutting the gunwales down to something like 15-17mm. Any thoughts on the wales?

Kurt

Cascadie
Frequent Poster
Frequent Poster
Posts: 33
Joined: Sun Jul 05, 2009 8:04 pm

Re: D5 weight in 4mm?

Post by Cascadie »

Well when they named S3 Hardener "Slow" they surely meant "Ridiculously Slow". I laminated the transoms at noon. At 9:30pm the transoms were still tacky, so I just bonded the cleats to the frames. The shop was around 80 F all day, guess it needed more like 95.
I used the S3 Five Minute epoxy in the tube and it was frantic trying to get the cleats clamped in time to lay another bead of epoxy before the tip went off! An interesting day of extremes.

Image

I got some stitches in at least. I'm an aircraft mechanic, so I have plenty of safety wire laying around. Heh.

Image

Our local paint store actually has some of the S3 GelMagic tubes. Has anyone used this for fillets? I guess I can go search... At the very least, I plan to purchase a tube and lay a bead outside between the stitches, then remove them after it's cured and see how I like the GelMagic. If it seems like it wont sag, I'll lay my fillets in.

Kurt

PJPiercey
* Bateau Builder - Expert *
* Bateau Builder - Expert *
Posts: 1446
Joined: Thu Aug 29, 2002 1:00 am
Location: WA

Re: D5 weight in 4mm?

Post by PJPiercey »

"Well when they named S3 Hardener "Slow" they surely meant "Ridiculously Slow". I laminated the transoms at noon. At 9:30pm the transoms were still tacky, so I just bonded the cleats to the frames."

When laminating the transom you should have coated the mating surfaces with mixed epoxy. Then mix wood flour into the mixed epoxy till its the consistency of ketchup. Spread the "ketchup" on the mating surfaces over the uncured epoxy you previously coated the surfaces with. Join the surfaces together. Place some weight on top while the "ketchup" cures. Make sure you follow the mixing ratio for the resin and hardener. Mix THOROUGHLY. Time your mixing for a full 2 minutes. Make sure you scrape the sides and bottom of your mixing container. If you do this correctly you will need the slow hardener in the current weather. I used the slow hardener all winter here in Edmonds. My garage was heated to 60 degrees. After 9 hours it might not be sandable, but you should be able to take the weight off, sureform the drips off the edges, and move on to the next stage. If it's a structural join with stress on it, leave the clamps on overnight before moving on. There is a fair amount of waiting involved with this process. :lol: Thinking time :doh: .

Gel Magic is a structural adhesive not a fillet material. You need the fiber (cabosil, woodflour, etc) in fillet material to give the joint the strength necessary for these designs. Also, when gluing, the slow curing of the epoxy allows maximum saturation of the wood fiber to give you a dependable bond. 5 minute epoxy is okay for "spot welding" but for large surfaces stick to gel magic or a mix of the standard epoxy and wood flour for your glue. S3 quick cure 5 minute epoxy is water resistant but not water proof and has very different strength properties :cry: . You'll be fine on the D5 with what you have done but for larger builds it would be a problem. Follow the tried and true methods and you'll be much happier.

Paul

Cascadie
Frequent Poster
Frequent Poster
Posts: 33
Joined: Sun Jul 05, 2009 8:04 pm

Re: D5 weight in 4mm?

Post by Cascadie »

Like this? I coated it, let it set for 1/2 hour and mixed more just shy of ketchup with microcellulose. I had good squeeze out initially and it didn't suck back in anywhere. (also note the Carl's Jr. cup of Dr. Pepper. You can't build a boat without coffee and Dr. Pepper, IMO) 8)

Image

I should have said that I have some boatbuilding experience before. My brother in law and I built the hulls for a 55' Catamaran over in Maui (the strongback alone was a 2 day project) and have built 2 other boats, one plywood and one double diagonal planked beach catamaran. I attempted a strip canoe in redwood, but had to abandon it, due to life circumstances. But I LOVE how helpful this community is! Thanks for ALL the advice. Some of the newer products like the GelMagic and 5 min epoxy weren't even dreamed of when I was boatbuilding before so on the newer techy stuff I'm just clueless. I'm very grateful for you guy's input. I have a lot yet to learn.

Thanks again!

Kurt

Post Reply

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 12 guests