Good morning - well, got all of the inside seams done this weekend, ready to flip it over tonight and start working on exterior. One minor question in my mind with that, though: I plan to coat the bottom with a layer of light cloth - - - should I do the seams first and then drape cloth over the whole bottom??? Or just do the big single cloth??? Or do the big single cloth and then add a second layer (of 6" biaxial tape) over the seams??
any thoughts or suggestions?
Yikes, I'm hoping this sucker is done before the boating season is done!!!!
~markb
Montana built D5
Re: Montana built D5
Continuing to make progress.
Just waiting for a shipment from Bateau with more gloves, more epoxy resin/hardner, and the cloth for the bottom.
I also ordered some fairing compound and paint. Not trying to turn this into a "work of art" like some of the BEAUTIFUL projects I see on here . . . but do want to make it at least "sorta" smooth.
So, continuing to work on things on the inside. Last night, I mounted the daggerboard trunk and the mast step. I'm wondering what holds down the daggerboard (keel) when sailing. Just friction fit?? I'm thinking though that the wood for the keel is bouyant and would want to float up??? No big deal, I'm sure a solution will appear when/if that happens.
Still looking for some feedback on the cloth for the outside bottom. Do I put the tape on the seams first and then the big cloth for the bottom . . . of cloth on the bottom first, and then a layer of tape on top of the cloth on top of the seams?
I also made the daggerboard/keel the other day. I had some mahogoney that I had used in a canoe project 25 years ago. Despite the water use for many many years . . . it was in perfect condition. That is some awesome wood. wow. Anyway, planed it down, edged the pieces, epoxied it together, and cut to shape. Also planed off the old finish. Super result.
Also remembered to epoxy a coin into the mast step too!!!
~markb
Just waiting for a shipment from Bateau with more gloves, more epoxy resin/hardner, and the cloth for the bottom.
I also ordered some fairing compound and paint. Not trying to turn this into a "work of art" like some of the BEAUTIFUL projects I see on here . . . but do want to make it at least "sorta" smooth.
So, continuing to work on things on the inside. Last night, I mounted the daggerboard trunk and the mast step. I'm wondering what holds down the daggerboard (keel) when sailing. Just friction fit?? I'm thinking though that the wood for the keel is bouyant and would want to float up??? No big deal, I'm sure a solution will appear when/if that happens.
Still looking for some feedback on the cloth for the outside bottom. Do I put the tape on the seams first and then the big cloth for the bottom . . . of cloth on the bottom first, and then a layer of tape on top of the cloth on top of the seams?
I also made the daggerboard/keel the other day. I had some mahogoney that I had used in a canoe project 25 years ago. Despite the water use for many many years . . . it was in perfect condition. That is some awesome wood. wow. Anyway, planed it down, edged the pieces, epoxied it together, and cut to shape. Also planed off the old finish. Super result.
Also remembered to epoxy a coin into the mast step too!!!
~markb
Re: Montana built D5
bratzcpa wrote: I'm wondering what holds down the daggerboard (keel) when sailing. Just friction fit?? I'm thinking though that the wood for the keel is bouyant and would want to float up??? No big deal, I'm sure a solution will appear when/if that happens.
~markb
Mark,
JM told me to cut out a whole after the daggerboard is done about 3 or 4 inch holesaw,
on the bottom portion of the daggerboard, place tape or plastic over one side of hole,
take shotgun lead shot and fill with epoxy/lead till the hole is filled, more epoxy to smooth out the top
and there you go
a weighted daggerboard,
PS. I have yet to do this to mine, it floats up just like you suspected. not a huge deal, just push it down when underway and it will stay.
Seams first then after that put on whole cloth bottom
. sanded on a canoe, bought a used boat, stayed at a holiday inn last night
- Cracker Larry
- * Bateau Builder - Expert *
- Posts: 22491
- Joined: Fri Mar 11, 2005 3:39 pm
- Location: Savannah, GA
Re: Montana built D5
Cool Did you do that Doc? Maybe that's what it needs to go to windwardAlso remembered to epoxy a coin into the mast step too!!!
Completed GF12 X 2, GF16, OD18, FS18, GF5, GF18, CL6
"Ships are the nearest things to dreams that hands have ever made." -Robert N. Rose
Re: Montana built D5
no never seen that,
please post pictures
I can always add one to mine,
which one Larry,
penny
nickel
dime
quarter
half dollar
one dollar
please post pictures
I can always add one to mine,
which one Larry,
penny
nickel
dime
quarter
half dollar
one dollar
. sanded on a canoe, bought a used boat, stayed at a holiday inn last night
- Cracker Larry
- * Bateau Builder - Expert *
- Posts: 22491
- Joined: Fri Mar 11, 2005 3:39 pm
- Location: Savannah, GA
Re: Montana built D5
A Krugerrand would be best, but an American Eagle $20 gold piece should work OK.
Completed GF12 X 2, GF16, OD18, FS18, GF5, GF18, CL6
"Ships are the nearest things to dreams that hands have ever made." -Robert N. Rose
Re: Montana built D5
I used a Montana Quarter, by the way. Hope 'Netpune' doesn't fault me for being cheap!!!!
Here are a bunch of other sailing "rules" to worry about:
http://sailing.info4uabout.com/2010/07/ ... tions.html
Have fun, markb
Here are a bunch of other sailing "rules" to worry about:
http://sailing.info4uabout.com/2010/07/ ... tions.html
Have fun, markb
-
- * Bateau Builder *
- Posts: 8403
- Joined: Mon Nov 24, 2003 1:00 am
- Location: NC USA
- Location: Now a much longer sail to Tampa Florida! Back to NC, Youngsville FM05tw
Re: Montana built D5
Actually, one of the worst faux pas's to do is to be so arrogant as to call the rules of Good Sailing Sense *superstitions*.
Re: Montana built D5
well, I flipped it over and am working on the outside now. Wow, this is a LOT more fun than all those little crooked angles on the inside around the seats and all that. Way more fun and much faster too.
I was concerned about trying to sand out all the overlaps and unevenness on some of the edge joints, but that actually worked out very very very easy. I used a belt sander to remove stock, than a random orbital sander to smooth it out.
I was also concerned about the "ends" of the zip ties sticking out (even though I tried to cut them flush), but honestly, they just sanded off without any trouble at all - perfectly smooth.
I like this!!!!!
One question though (hope you all don't mind my "rookie" questions) - I am wondering about the waterproofness of the daggerboard/keel trunk. I cut out the "hole" on the hull - it sure looks to me like some water might "sneak by" along the edges of the trunk, or perhaps where the trunk joins the hull. I am thinking about taking a small piece of tape and basically doing that "seam" (1/2 of it on the hull, and the other 1/2 bent into the "hole"). I think I can squeeze my finger into the hole to smooth out that half. I'm not sure I described that very well, but hopefully that makes sense. I would welcome any thoughts on this.
it's coming along - I can sorta see the end?? perhaps??
My order from Bateau arrived yesterday - it included the paint!!! someday, right?
Cheers,
~markb
I was concerned about trying to sand out all the overlaps and unevenness on some of the edge joints, but that actually worked out very very very easy. I used a belt sander to remove stock, than a random orbital sander to smooth it out.
I was also concerned about the "ends" of the zip ties sticking out (even though I tried to cut them flush), but honestly, they just sanded off without any trouble at all - perfectly smooth.
I like this!!!!!
One question though (hope you all don't mind my "rookie" questions) - I am wondering about the waterproofness of the daggerboard/keel trunk. I cut out the "hole" on the hull - it sure looks to me like some water might "sneak by" along the edges of the trunk, or perhaps where the trunk joins the hull. I am thinking about taking a small piece of tape and basically doing that "seam" (1/2 of it on the hull, and the other 1/2 bent into the "hole"). I think I can squeeze my finger into the hole to smooth out that half. I'm not sure I described that very well, but hopefully that makes sense. I would welcome any thoughts on this.
it's coming along - I can sorta see the end?? perhaps??
My order from Bateau arrived yesterday - it included the paint!!! someday, right?
Cheers,
~markb
-
- * Bateau Builder *
- Posts: 8403
- Joined: Mon Nov 24, 2003 1:00 am
- Location: NC USA
- Location: Now a much longer sail to Tampa Florida! Back to NC, Youngsville FM05tw
Re: Montana built D5
Regarding cloth on bottom.... tape first them cloth over tape. You can even do it wet on wet and save time between laminations, but round your chine and keel edges a little first..
Regarding daggerboard... as far as I know, the tape around the hole into the trunk is usually the way it is done. Of course that means the hole will get smaller due to the thickness of the tape. Also, if there are any obvious gaps between hull bottom edges and daggerboard trunk, that gets filled with an epoxy wood flour blend.
I glued the trunk in from the inside first, so I could work more easily from the outside later, but I had to be careful cutting the slot undersize, and then dremeling it carefully to size, but you can also cut the slot first and fit the trunk into it, either way. Just plan how you will hold and clamp things in place during the initial *get it locked in position* cure.
Trunk is already bonded and taped in on the inside at this point.
6088
Then the undersize cut gets widened with dremel, then routed. The rounded edge helps the tape take the turn better into the slot.
6104
I then biax taped from the hull bottom, around the slot's rounded edge, and up into the slot. Here is has all been scratched up after the biax cure, so I could do a CB test fit. I had planned slot and board dimensions, after all the finish systems, so it would fit with slight room to spare.
6136
Plenty room before the I added the keel foot and faired and painted.
6138
After all the finish systems, and having added an optional keel foot, I planned a little closer than I'd like, but it does fit and pivot nicely, and doesn't vibrate or hum at all.
7117
The D5 is clearly a very simple boat and your slot and taping can be very simple, but it will be easier if you round that edge for the tape. The trunk can either sit on the bottom panels (like mine), or you can cut the slot wide to insert the entire trunk into the slot for bonding and taping. When all is cured, it is a composite structure anyway with plywood core and fillets and tape on both side of the bond to the hull. Remember to be aware of how the slot thickness will decrease once you tape up in there and fair and paint it.
Have fun fixing that big slot you cut in the bottom of your boat.
Regarding daggerboard... as far as I know, the tape around the hole into the trunk is usually the way it is done. Of course that means the hole will get smaller due to the thickness of the tape. Also, if there are any obvious gaps between hull bottom edges and daggerboard trunk, that gets filled with an epoxy wood flour blend.
I glued the trunk in from the inside first, so I could work more easily from the outside later, but I had to be careful cutting the slot undersize, and then dremeling it carefully to size, but you can also cut the slot first and fit the trunk into it, either way. Just plan how you will hold and clamp things in place during the initial *get it locked in position* cure.
Trunk is already bonded and taped in on the inside at this point.
6088
Then the undersize cut gets widened with dremel, then routed. The rounded edge helps the tape take the turn better into the slot.
6104
I then biax taped from the hull bottom, around the slot's rounded edge, and up into the slot. Here is has all been scratched up after the biax cure, so I could do a CB test fit. I had planned slot and board dimensions, after all the finish systems, so it would fit with slight room to spare.
6136
Plenty room before the I added the keel foot and faired and painted.
6138
After all the finish systems, and having added an optional keel foot, I planned a little closer than I'd like, but it does fit and pivot nicely, and doesn't vibrate or hum at all.
7117
The D5 is clearly a very simple boat and your slot and taping can be very simple, but it will be easier if you round that edge for the tape. The trunk can either sit on the bottom panels (like mine), or you can cut the slot wide to insert the entire trunk into the slot for bonding and taping. When all is cured, it is a composite structure anyway with plywood core and fillets and tape on both side of the bond to the hull. Remember to be aware of how the slot thickness will decrease once you tape up in there and fair and paint it.
Have fun fixing that big slot you cut in the bottom of your boat.
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